Talk:Container - Revision history

Furey: /* Touchstone? */ I think derekt75 is right. rock gets replaced by a limited replacement set, but an initial touchstone or flintstone is not replaced.

2024-06-04T13:39:05Z

‎Touchstone?: I think derekt75 is right. rock gets replaced by a limited replacement set, but an initial touchstone or flintstone is not replaced.

Derekt75: /* Touchstone? */ new section

2023-03-21T20:47:45Z

‎Touchstone?: new section

D4 wryyyy: /* Wetting */ new section

2022-02-19T06:51:19Z

‎Wetting: new section

D4 wryyyy: /* Generation re BUC status */

2021-07-28T21:02:58Z

‎Generation re BUC status

D4 wryyyy: /* Generation re BUC status */

2021-07-28T10:55:20Z

‎Generation re BUC status

Luxidream at 03:12, 28 July 2021

2021-07-28T03:12:59Z

D4 wryyyy: /* Generation re BUC status */ new section

2021-07-28T02:28:21Z

‎Generation re BUC status: new section

Phol ende wodan: Removed another 2012 debate about a resolved issue and irrelevant math

2017-05-08T14:59:43Z

Removed another 2012 debate about a resolved issue and irrelevant math

Phol ende wodan: Remove 2008 discussion about stuff that's on the page, remove 2012 Q&A that is irrelevant to the page

2017-05-08T01:34:15Z

Remove 2008 discussion about stuff that's on the page, remove 2012 Q&A that is irrelevant to the page

Ion frigate: /* unbounded */

2012-09-12T17:19:54Z

‎unbounded

← Older revision		Revision as of 13:39, 4 June 2024
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	Is it true that a touchstone cannot be generated in a container?		Is it true that a touchstone cannot be generated in a container?
	I see the code that changes rocks into other stones does not allow touchstones or flint stones, but I thought the initial call of mkobj(GEM_CLASS, true) would allow the creation of a touchstone or flint, no? [[User:Derekt75\|Derekt75]] ([[User talk:Derekt75\|talk]]) 20:47, 21 March 2023 (UTC)		I see the code that changes rocks into other stones does not allow touchstones or flint stones, but I thought the initial call of mkobj(GEM_CLASS, true) would allow the creation of a touchstone or flint, no? [[User:Derekt75\|Derekt75]] ([[User talk:Derekt75\|talk]]) 20:47, 21 March 2023 (UTC)
		+
		+	: I think you're right! Editing the article now. [[User:Furey\|Furey]] ([[User talk:Furey\|talk]]) 13:39, 4 June 2024 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 20:47, 21 March 2023
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	"If you get into or under the water without wearing an '''[[oilskin cloak]],''' only a non-cursed oilskin sack... or a large box completely '''protects its contents from the water damage.'''" Implying an oilskin cloak does protect carried items from wetting? Afaik it only protects from drowning and from rusting armor. The oilskin cloak page doesn't say anything about items.[[User:D4 wryyyy\|D4 wryyyy]] ([[User talk:D4 wryyyy\|talk]]) 06:51, 19 February 2022 (UTC)		"If you get into or under the water without wearing an '''[[oilskin cloak]],''' only a non-cursed oilskin sack... or a large box completely '''protects its contents from the water damage.'''" Implying an oilskin cloak does protect carried items from wetting? Afaik it only protects from drowning and from rusting armor. The oilskin cloak page doesn't say anything about items.[[User:D4 wryyyy\|D4 wryyyy]] ([[User talk:D4 wryyyy\|talk]]) 06:51, 19 February 2022 (UTC)
	:: Not to mention that list leaves out a [[grease]]d [[BoH]] or [[sack]].		:: Not to mention that list leaves out a [[grease]]d [[BoH]] or [[sack]].
		+
		+	== Touchstone? ==
		+
		+	Is it true that a touchstone cannot be generated in a container?
		+	I see the code that changes rocks into other stones does not allow touchstones or flint stones, but I thought the initial call of mkobj(GEM_CLASS, true) would allow the creation of a touchstone or flint, no? [[User:Derekt75\|Derekt75]] ([[User talk:Derekt75\|talk]]) 20:47, 21 March 2023 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 06:51, 19 February 2022
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	:: thanks. mind if i quote you? [[User:D4 wryyyy\|D4 wryyyy]] ([[User talk:D4 wryyyy\|talk]]) 10:55, 28 July 2021 (UTC)		:: thanks. mind if i quote you? [[User:D4 wryyyy\|D4 wryyyy]] ([[User talk:D4 wryyyy\|talk]]) 10:55, 28 July 2021 (UTC)
	:: nvm someone added it. i wasn't sure of the wording [[User:D4 wryyyy\|D4 wryyyy]] ([[User talk:D4 wryyyy\|talk]]) 21:02, 28 July 2021 (UTC)		:: nvm someone added it. i wasn't sure of the wording [[User:D4 wryyyy\|D4 wryyyy]] ([[User talk:D4 wryyyy\|talk]]) 21:02, 28 July 2021 (UTC)
		+
		+	== Wetting ==
		+
		+	The section on [[wet]]ting says
		+	"If you get into or under the water without wearing an '''[[oilskin cloak]],''' only a non-cursed oilskin sack... or a large box completely '''protects its contents from the water damage.'''" Implying an oilskin cloak does protect carried items from wetting? Afaik it only protects from drowning and from rusting armor. The oilskin cloak page doesn't say anything about items.[[User:D4 wryyyy\|D4 wryyyy]] ([[User talk:D4 wryyyy\|talk]]) 06:51, 19 February 2022 (UTC)
		+	:: Not to mention that list leaves out a [[grease]]d [[BoH]] or [[sack]].

← Older revision		Revision as of 21:02, 28 July 2021
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	:: thanks. mind if i quote you? [[User:D4 wryyyy\|D4 wryyyy]] ([[User talk:D4 wryyyy\|talk]]) 10:55, 28 July 2021 (UTC)		:: thanks. mind if i quote you? [[User:D4 wryyyy\|D4 wryyyy]] ([[User talk:D4 wryyyy\|talk]]) 10:55, 28 July 2021 (UTC)
		+	:: nvm someone added it. i wasn't sure of the wording [[User:D4 wryyyy\|D4 wryyyy]] ([[User talk:D4 wryyyy\|talk]]) 21:02, 28 July 2021 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 10:55, 28 July 2021
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	Sauce: I'm currently holding a generated-cursed BoH that didn't come from a bones file. [[User:D4 wryyyy\|D4 wryyyy]] ([[User talk:D4 wryyyy\|talk]]) 02:28, 28 July 2021 (UTC)		Sauce: I'm currently holding a generated-cursed BoH that didn't come from a bones file. [[User:D4 wryyyy\|D4 wryyyy]] ([[User talk:D4 wryyyy\|talk]]) 02:28, 28 July 2021 (UTC)
	: You can get a cursed bag of holding from a fake bones pile generated on early traps, which can have tools on them. Cursed containers don't generate normally. --[[User:Luxidream\|Luxidream]] ([[User talk:Luxidream\|talk]]) 03:12, 28 July 2021 (UTC)		: You can get a cursed bag of holding from a fake bones pile generated on early traps, which can have tools on them. Cursed containers don't generate normally. --[[User:Luxidream\|Luxidream]] ([[User talk:Luxidream\|talk]]) 03:12, 28 July 2021 (UTC)
		+
		+	:: thanks. mind if i quote you? [[User:D4 wryyyy\|D4 wryyyy]] ([[User talk:D4 wryyyy\|talk]]) 10:55, 28 July 2021 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 03:12, 28 July 2021
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	The Generation section says "Containers are generated uncursed" but I'm pretty sure BoH can be generated cursed. Does anyone know the relevant source code?		The Generation section says "Containers are generated uncursed" but I'm pretty sure BoH can be generated cursed. Does anyone know the relevant source code?
	Sauce: I'm currently holding a generated-cursed BoH that didn't come from a bones file. [[User:D4 wryyyy\|D4 wryyyy]] ([[User talk:D4 wryyyy\|talk]]) 02:28, 28 July 2021 (UTC)		Sauce: I'm currently holding a generated-cursed BoH that didn't come from a bones file. [[User:D4 wryyyy\|D4 wryyyy]] ([[User talk:D4 wryyyy\|talk]]) 02:28, 28 July 2021 (UTC)
		+	: You can get a cursed bag of holding from a fake bones pile generated on early traps, which can have tools on them. Cursed containers don't generate normally. --[[User:Luxidream\|Luxidream]] ([[User talk:Luxidream\|talk]]) 03:12, 28 July 2021 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 02:28, 28 July 2021
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	:Any cursed item will work to deter pets. Rather than using unholy water to curse the container you could just drop a single unholy water. However this isn't really necessary, if all you want to do is stop pets from picking up the box. Putting another item on top of the box (by simply dropping it on the same square) will make any pet pick up that item instead. And if the box is heavy enough, your pets won't pick it up anyway. -- [[User:Qazmlpok\|Qazmlpok]] ([[User talk:Qazmlpok\|talk]]) 20:27, 30 June 2012 (UTC)		:Any cursed item will work to deter pets. Rather than using unholy water to curse the container you could just drop a single unholy water. However this isn't really necessary, if all you want to do is stop pets from picking up the box. Putting another item on top of the box (by simply dropping it on the same square) will make any pet pick up that item instead. And if the box is heavy enough, your pets won't pick it up anyway. -- [[User:Qazmlpok\|Qazmlpok]] ([[User talk:Qazmlpok\|talk]]) 20:27, 30 June 2012 (UTC)
	::For very large values of heavy enough, in case you have a pet dragon etc. Stash best practises: You drop the chest, then drop one holy water (for cursed two-handed weapons), then drop a cursed object on top that your autopickup exceptions will never pick up. --[[User:Tjr\|Tjr]] ([[User talk:Tjr\|talk]]) 21:32, 30 June 2012 (UTC)		::For very large values of heavy enough, in case you have a pet dragon etc. Stash best practises: You drop the chest, then drop one holy water (for cursed two-handed weapons), then drop a cursed object on top that your autopickup exceptions will never pick up. --[[User:Tjr\|Tjr]] ([[User talk:Tjr\|talk]]) 21:32, 30 June 2012 (UTC)
		+
		+	== Generation re BUC status ==
		+
		+	The Generation section says "Containers are generated uncursed" but I'm pretty sure BoH can be generated cursed. Does anyone know the relevant source code?
		+	Sauce: I'm currently holding a generated-cursed BoH that didn't come from a bones file. [[User:D4 wryyyy\|D4 wryyyy]] ([[User talk:D4 wryyyy\|talk]]) 02:28, 28 July 2021 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 14:59, 8 May 2017
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	:Any cursed item will work to deter pets. Rather than using unholy water to curse the container you could just drop a single unholy water. However this isn't really necessary, if all you want to do is stop pets from picking up the box. Putting another item on top of the box (by simply dropping it on the same square) will make any pet pick up that item instead. And if the box is heavy enough, your pets won't pick it up anyway. -- [[User:Qazmlpok\|Qazmlpok]] ([[User talk:Qazmlpok\|talk]]) 20:27, 30 June 2012 (UTC)		:Any cursed item will work to deter pets. Rather than using unholy water to curse the container you could just drop a single unholy water. However this isn't really necessary, if all you want to do is stop pets from picking up the box. Putting another item on top of the box (by simply dropping it on the same square) will make any pet pick up that item instead. And if the box is heavy enough, your pets won't pick it up anyway. -- [[User:Qazmlpok\|Qazmlpok]] ([[User talk:Qazmlpok\|talk]]) 20:27, 30 June 2012 (UTC)
	::For very large values of heavy enough, in case you have a pet dragon etc. Stash best practises: You drop the chest, then drop one holy water (for cursed two-handed weapons), then drop a cursed object on top that your autopickup exceptions will never pick up. --[[User:Tjr\|Tjr]] ([[User talk:Tjr\|talk]]) 21:32, 30 June 2012 (UTC)		::For very large values of heavy enough, in case you have a pet dragon etc. Stash best practises: You drop the chest, then drop one holy water (for cursed two-handed weapons), then drop a cursed object on top that your autopickup exceptions will never pick up. --[[User:Tjr\|Tjr]] ([[User talk:Tjr\|talk]]) 21:32, 30 June 2012 (UTC)
−
−	~~== unbounded ==~~
−	*is the number of times a back of tricks has been charged held internally? is this number used anywhere? if it is used and it wraps, does the game choke? "infinite" is correct if the answer to any of those questions is "no". the fact that you won't get beyond a finite number of times doesn't mean the upper bound's not infinite. think of counting. "indefinite" just seems wrong. "undefined" and "unbounded" don't work, either. --[[Special:Contributions/194.116.198.185\|194.116.198.185]] 11:56, 11 September 2012 (UTC)
−	~~::It is not tracked. -- [[User:Qazmlpok\|Qazmlpok]] ([[User talk:Qazmlpok\|talk]]) 12:43, 11 September 2012 (UTC)~~
−	::It's not tracked, but that doesn't matter. Perhaps "unlimited" would be a better word than "indefinite" or "undefined" though, but "infinite" is very wrong in a literal sense. NetHack is played by humans. Humans have a finite lifespan in which they can recharge bags of tricks. Frankly, using "infinite" to describe most real-world concepts is wrong; infinity only really exists inside of mathematics and arguably physics. -[[User:Ion frigate\|Ion frigate]] ([[User talk:Ion frigate\|talk]]) 23:06, 11 September 2012 (UTC)
−	~~:::that makes no sense. try "numbers are not infinite because no one could get to infinity by counting." --[[Special:Contributions/194.116.198.185\|194.116.198.185]] 11:42, 12 September 2012 (UTC)~~
−	::::I'm not claiming infinite numbers don't exist. I'm claiming that discrete, observable quantities (and despite not being tracked, charging a bag of tricks, or any action in Nethack actually, is observable) are not infinite, owing to the fact that our '''observable''' universe is, well, finite. Infinite numbers are very commonly used in mathematics and exist within that context, but despite the level of abstraction it has, NetHack is a real-world game and not a mathematical theorem. Anyway, "unlimited" works quite well. -[[User:Ion frigate\|Ion frigate]] ([[User talk:Ion frigate\|talk]]) 17:19, 12 September 2012 (UTC)

@@ Line 1: / Line 1: @@
 ==slashem polymorph trick==
 Will this anger a shopkeeper, if that is where the ice box happens to be? I'd think yes. [[User:Tjr|Tjr]] 13:42, 29 April 2009 (UTC)
 Does a food store buy ice boxes? [[User:Tjr|Tjr]] 16:23, 21 May 2009 (UTC)
@@ Line 72: / Line 61: @@
 :In that particular situation, there's no issue with cnt. Even if you did have 4 billion objects, unless you had ''exactly'' 4294967296 objects in there you wouldn't have a problem. cnt is only used to check if the bag is empty, nothing else. If you had that exact number of items in a bag it would mistakenly think it was empty (it'd also take forever to discover this; looping up to 4 billion isn't exactly fast), but you could remedy this by putting one more item in.
 :The real question is in adding items to a bag, as there might be some other bit of code that would break if you exceed 32k or 4 billion. The items in a container are stored in a linked list, which on its own can hold any number of objects until you run out of memory. I can't figure out the exact code used for adding items to bags or taking them out, so there might be something troublesome in there. -- [[User:Qazmlpok|Qazmlpok]] 13:04, 10 December 2011 (UTC)
 == BUC Status ==

← Older revision		Revision as of 17:19, 12 September 2012
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	::It's not tracked, but that doesn't matter. Perhaps "unlimited" would be a better word than "indefinite" or "undefined" though, but "infinite" is very wrong in a literal sense. NetHack is played by humans. Humans have a finite lifespan in which they can recharge bags of tricks. Frankly, using "infinite" to describe most real-world concepts is wrong; infinity only really exists inside of mathematics and arguably physics. -[[User:Ion frigate\|Ion frigate]] ([[User talk:Ion frigate\|talk]]) 23:06, 11 September 2012 (UTC)		::It's not tracked, but that doesn't matter. Perhaps "unlimited" would be a better word than "indefinite" or "undefined" though, but "infinite" is very wrong in a literal sense. NetHack is played by humans. Humans have a finite lifespan in which they can recharge bags of tricks. Frankly, using "infinite" to describe most real-world concepts is wrong; infinity only really exists inside of mathematics and arguably physics. -[[User:Ion frigate\|Ion frigate]] ([[User talk:Ion frigate\|talk]]) 23:06, 11 September 2012 (UTC)
	:::that makes no sense. try "numbers are not infinite because no one could get to infinity by counting." --[[Special:Contributions/194.116.198.185\|194.116.198.185]] 11:42, 12 September 2012 (UTC)		:::that makes no sense. try "numbers are not infinite because no one could get to infinity by counting." --[[Special:Contributions/194.116.198.185\|194.116.198.185]] 11:42, 12 September 2012 (UTC)
		+	::::I'm not claiming infinite numbers don't exist. I'm claiming that discrete, observable quantities (and despite not being tracked, charging a bag of tricks, or any action in Nethack actually, is observable) are not infinite, owing to the fact that our '''observable''' universe is, well, finite. Infinite numbers are very commonly used in mathematics and exist within that context, but despite the level of abstraction it has, NetHack is a real-world game and not a mathematical theorem. Anyway, "unlimited" works quite well. -[[User:Ion frigate\|Ion frigate]] ([[User talk:Ion frigate\|talk]]) 17:19, 12 September 2012 (UTC)