Talk:Gypsy - Revision history

Jundavr: /* Infinite wishes */

2018-03-11T01:17:34Z

‎Infinite wishes

Jundavr: /* Infinite wishes */ new section

2018-03-11T01:16:13Z

‎Infinite wishes: new section

Jundavr: /* What's this? */

2017-06-30T12:21:42Z

‎What's this?

Ion frigate: /* Loophole */

2011-12-20T13:12:23Z

‎Loophole

S.K.: /* Loophole */

2011-12-19T22:20:22Z

‎Loophole

S.K. at 22:19, 19 December 2011

2011-12-19T22:19:51Z

S.K. at 22:18, 19 December 2011

2011-12-19T22:18:37Z

Ion frigate at 02:25, 19 December 2011

2011-12-19T02:25:31Z

Qazmlpok: /* Loophole */

2011-12-19T00:21:28Z

‎Loophole

S.K. at 22:57, 18 December 2011

2011-12-18T22:57:08Z

@@ Line 45: / Line 45: @@
 There isn't a limit to how many wishes you can get if you wish for a statue of a gypsy every time you get a wish. Since stone to flesh'ing a statue doesn't respect extinction (neither do wishing for statues), with enough patience (and mild insanity) you could ascend with something like 5000 wishes.
-With enough knowledge, resources aren't a concern to begin with, since you can just maximize your luck and play three card monte ("You win. Wasn't that easy?") and keep betting 999 coins and alterning cards so you almost always get the "Wasn't that easy?" part. If you don't, just keep betting 1 coin and wait until you lose, next time you'll get the "Wasn't that easy?" again, which will ensure your next win, and you can farm credit easily that way. A strong pet, such as a mind flayer or a dragon can easily take care of the cancelled gypsies (healing spells recommended) and clear the level (I usually farm wishes this way in sokoban). As a final remark, after about 20 wishes you'll probably already have everything you need to ascend and become overpowered, so if this is to be attempted, it would be a nice idea to just keep wishing for statues as soon as you don't need wishes anymore, and as soon as reverse genocide starts failing (or you can check for the gypsy count in #vanquished) you can stone to flesh the statues.
+With enough knowledge, resources aren't a concern to begin with, since you can just maximize your luck and play three card monte ("You win. Wasn't that easy?") and keep betting 999 coins and alternating cards so you almost always get the "Wasn't that easy?" part. If you don't, just keep betting 1 coin and wait until you lose, next time you'll get the "Wasn't that easy?" again, which will ensure your next win, and you can farm credit easily that way. A strong pet, such as a mind flayer or a dragon can easily take care of the cancelled gypsies (healing spells recommended) and clear the level (I usually farm wishes this way in sokoban). As a final remark, after about 20 wishes you'll probably already have everything you need to ascend and become overpowered, so if this is to be attempted, it would be a nice idea to just keep wishing for statues as soon as you don't need wishes anymore, and as soon as reverse genocide starts failing (or you can check for the gypsy count in #vanquished) you can stone to flesh the statues.
 Polipiling boulders and statues doesn't seem to result in a gypsy ever, but I haven't checked the source for this.
 It's trivial to create statues, tough, since all you have to do is cast polymorph on a bunch of easily generated objects (such as stones) until you create a golem and bash it with a footrice corpse, or let a digging monster go wild on a level and use the boulders.
 --[[User:Jundavr|Jundavr]] ([[User talk:Jundavr|talk]]) 01:16, 11 March 2018 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 01:16, 11 March 2018
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	:::::@Qazmlpok - I saw Your screenshot before. Really nice work. --[[User:S.K.\|S.K.]] 22:18, 19 December 2011 (UTC)		:::::@Qazmlpok - I saw Your screenshot before. Really nice work. --[[User:S.K.\|S.K.]] 22:18, 19 December 2011 (UTC)
	::::::If it's that bothersome, just read each scroll of genocide on a new level. Then you'll have around 5 gypsies a level, which isn't that overwhelming. -[[User:Ion frigate\|Ion frigate]] 13:12, 20 December 2011 (UTC)		::::::If it's that bothersome, just read each scroll of genocide on a new level. Then you'll have around 5 gypsies a level, which isn't that overwhelming. -[[User:Ion frigate\|Ion frigate]] 13:12, 20 December 2011 (UTC)
		+
		+	== Infinite wishes ==
		+
		+	There isn't a limit to how many wishes you can get if you wish for a statue of a gypsy every time you get a wish. Since stone to flesh'ing a statue doesn't respect extinction (neither do wishing for statues), with enough patience (and mild insanity) you could ascend with something like 5000 wishes.
		+	With enough knowledge, resources aren't a concern to begin with, since you can just maximize your luck and play three card monte ("You win. Wasn't that easy?") and keep betting 999 coins and alterning cards so you almost always get the "Wasn't that easy?" part. If you don't, just keep betting 1 coin and wait until you lose, next time you'll get the "Wasn't that easy?" again, which will ensure your next win, and you can farm credit easily that way. A strong pet, such as a mind flayer or a dragon can easily take care of the cancelled gypsies (healing spells recommended) and clear the level (I usually farm wishes this way in sokoban). As a final remark, after about 20 wishes you'll probably already have everything you need to ascend and become overpowered, so if this is to be attempted, it would be a nice idea to just keep wishing for statues as soon as you don't need wishes anymore, and as soon as reverse genocide starts failing (or you can check for the gypsy count in #vanquished) you can stone to flesh the statues.
		+
		+	Polipiling boulders and statues doesn't seem to result in a gypsy ever, but I haven't checked the source for this.
		+	It's trivial to create statues, tough, since all you have to do is cast polymorph on a bunch of easily generated objects (such as stones) until you create a golem and bash it with a footrice corpse, or let a digging monster go wild on a level and use the boulders.
		+	--[[User:Jundavr\|Jundavr]] ([[User talk:Jundavr\|talk]]) 01:16, 11 March 2018 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 12:21, 30 June 2017
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	::Yes. Thanks. [[User:720\|720]] 14:45, 8 August 2011 (UTC)		::Yes. Thanks. [[User:720\|720]] 14:45, 8 August 2011 (UTC)
		+
		+	:I know this is incredibly old, but I'd just like to add that a gypsy told me the location of the high altar (DL61) even though the maximum I've descent was to DL11. It happened in the gnomish mines, just below minetown where I reverse genocided gypsies. Many other visions (Tower, Magician) never worked, though. ——[[User:Jundavr\|Jundavr]] ([[User talk:Jundavr\|talk]]) 12:21, 30 June 2017 (UTC)

	==Loophole==		==Loophole==

← Older revision		Revision as of 13:12, 20 December 2011
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	:::::But if You have big amount of gypies, You must use far look command to make sure who can grant You wish, or cancelling #chat when You realize that you #chatting with called gypsy - I'm right, or missed something? But it's still ony for comfort.		:::::But if You have big amount of gypies, You must use far look command to make sure who can grant You wish, or cancelling #chat when You realize that you #chatting with called gypsy - I'm right, or missed something? But it's still ony for comfort.
	:::::@Qazmlpok - I saw Your screenshot before. Really nice work. --[[User:S.K.\|S.K.]] 22:18, 19 December 2011 (UTC)		:::::@Qazmlpok - I saw Your screenshot before. Really nice work. --[[User:S.K.\|S.K.]] 22:18, 19 December 2011 (UTC)
		+	::::::If it's that bothersome, just read each scroll of genocide on a new level. Then you'll have around 5 gypsies a level, which isn't that overwhelming. -[[User:Ion frigate\|Ion frigate]] 13:12, 20 December 2011 (UTC)

@@ Line 37: / Line 37: @@
 ::::"About killing gypsies - even Archon can easly kill them, but in fact, only reason for this for me is only keeping neatness - looking for right Gypsy among 50 other - when you going to have a lot wishes - can be really annoying." - There's a really simple solution to this problem.  Name gypsies who have given you a wish (with 'C').  There's no need to kill them, and no benefit from doing so if you're doing it via a pet.  -[[User:Ion frigate|Ion frigate]] 02:25, 19 December 2011 (UTC)
 :::::But if You have big amount of gypies, You must use far look command to make sure who can grant You wish, or cancelling #chat when You realize that you #chatting with called gypsy - I'm right, or missed something? But it's still ony for comfort.
-@Qazmlpok - I saw Your screenshot before. Really nice work. --[[User:S.K.|S.K.]] 22:18, 19 December 2011 (UTC)
+:::::@Qazmlpok - I saw Your screenshot before. Really nice work. --[[User:S.K.|S.K.]] 22:18, 19 December 2011 (UTC)

@@ Line 36: / Line 36: @@
 ::::Doppelgangers can't #twoweapon. That's about it. They have superb stats (all except charisma, but if you poly into a foocubus you get 18 charisma), can poly at will from level 1 and get poly control at level 9. You only need 20 power to turn into ANYTHING, the remainder is made up with nutrition which is easy to recover. Polymorphing also isn't quite an "oLS - if you die from anything other than hp loss you're still dead, and if you have polymorph control (and you do after level 9) you lose max HP. Additionally /oCancel will automatically revert you to human form AND take away max hp if you aren't unchanging or magic resistant. They're the most laughably unbalanced part of the game; see [[User:Qazmlpok]] for two examples. I've spent some time trying an inventoryless game, and it's actually very possible thanks to polyself. Maybe that'll be my third screenshot someday. -- [[User:Qazmlpok|Qazmlpok]] 00:21, 19 December 2011 (UTC)
 ::::"About killing gypsies - even Archon can easly kill them, but in fact, only reason for this for me is only keeping neatness - looking for right Gypsy among 50 other - when you going to have a lot wishes - can be really annoying." - There's a really simple solution to this problem.  Name gypsies who have given you a wish (with 'C').  There's no need to kill them, and no benefit from doing so if you're doing it via a pet.  -[[User:Ion frigate|Ion frigate]] 02:25, 19 December 2011 (UTC)
-:::::But if You have big amount of gypies, You must use far look command to make sure who can grant You wish, or cancelling #chat when You realize that you #chatting with called gypsy - I'm right, or missed something? But it's still ony for comfort. --[[User:S.K.|S.K.]] 22:18, 19 December 2011 (UTC)
+:::::But if You have big amount of gypies, You must use far look command to make sure who can grant You wish, or cancelling #chat when You realize that you #chatting with called gypsy - I'm right, or missed something? But it's still ony for comfort.

← Older revision		Revision as of 22:18, 19 December 2011
Line 36:		Line 36:
	::::Doppelgangers can't #twoweapon. That's about it. They have superb stats (all except charisma, but if you poly into a foocubus you get 18 charisma), can poly at will from level 1 and get poly control at level 9. You only need 20 power to turn into ANYTHING, the remainder is made up with nutrition which is easy to recover. Polymorphing also isn't quite an "oLS - if you die from anything other than hp loss you're still dead, and if you have polymorph control (and you do after level 9) you lose max HP. Additionally /oCancel will automatically revert you to human form AND take away max hp if you aren't unchanging or magic resistant. They're the most laughably unbalanced part of the game; see [[User:Qazmlpok]] for two examples. I've spent some time trying an inventoryless game, and it's actually very possible thanks to polyself. Maybe that'll be my third screenshot someday. -- [[User:Qazmlpok\|Qazmlpok]] 00:21, 19 December 2011 (UTC)		::::Doppelgangers can't #twoweapon. That's about it. They have superb stats (all except charisma, but if you poly into a foocubus you get 18 charisma), can poly at will from level 1 and get poly control at level 9. You only need 20 power to turn into ANYTHING, the remainder is made up with nutrition which is easy to recover. Polymorphing also isn't quite an "oLS - if you die from anything other than hp loss you're still dead, and if you have polymorph control (and you do after level 9) you lose max HP. Additionally /oCancel will automatically revert you to human form AND take away max hp if you aren't unchanging or magic resistant. They're the most laughably unbalanced part of the game; see [[User:Qazmlpok]] for two examples. I've spent some time trying an inventoryless game, and it's actually very possible thanks to polyself. Maybe that'll be my third screenshot someday. -- [[User:Qazmlpok\|Qazmlpok]] 00:21, 19 December 2011 (UTC)
	::::"About killing gypsies - even Archon can easly kill them, but in fact, only reason for this for me is only keeping neatness - looking for right Gypsy among 50 other - when you going to have a lot wishes - can be really annoying." - There's a really simple solution to this problem. Name gypsies who have given you a wish (with 'C'). There's no need to kill them, and no benefit from doing so if you're doing it via a pet. -[[User:Ion frigate\|Ion frigate]] 02:25, 19 December 2011 (UTC)		::::"About killing gypsies - even Archon can easly kill them, but in fact, only reason for this for me is only keeping neatness - looking for right Gypsy among 50 other - when you going to have a lot wishes - can be really annoying." - There's a really simple solution to this problem. Name gypsies who have given you a wish (with 'C'). There's no need to kill them, and no benefit from doing so if you're doing it via a pet. -[[User:Ion frigate\|Ion frigate]] 02:25, 19 December 2011 (UTC)
		+	:::::But if You have big amount of gypies, You must use far look command to make sure who can grant You wish, or cancelling #chat when You realize that you #chatting with called gypsy - I'm right, or missed something? But it's still ony for comfort. --[[User:S.K.\|S.K.]] 22:18, 19 December 2011 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 02:25, 19 December 2011
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	:::I think it's good idea to forbid any means of polymorph control for doppelgangers in SLASH'EM leaving only chances system ((monster level - your level)/5) --[[User:S.K.\|S.K.]] 22:57, 18 December 2011 (UTC)		:::I think it's good idea to forbid any means of polymorph control for doppelgangers in SLASH'EM leaving only chances system ((monster level - your level)/5) --[[User:S.K.\|S.K.]] 22:57, 18 December 2011 (UTC)
	::::Doppelgangers can't #twoweapon. That's about it. They have superb stats (all except charisma, but if you poly into a foocubus you get 18 charisma), can poly at will from level 1 and get poly control at level 9. You only need 20 power to turn into ANYTHING, the remainder is made up with nutrition which is easy to recover. Polymorphing also isn't quite an "oLS - if you die from anything other than hp loss you're still dead, and if you have polymorph control (and you do after level 9) you lose max HP. Additionally /oCancel will automatically revert you to human form AND take away max hp if you aren't unchanging or magic resistant. They're the most laughably unbalanced part of the game; see [[User:Qazmlpok]] for two examples. I've spent some time trying an inventoryless game, and it's actually very possible thanks to polyself. Maybe that'll be my third screenshot someday. -- [[User:Qazmlpok\|Qazmlpok]] 00:21, 19 December 2011 (UTC)		::::Doppelgangers can't #twoweapon. That's about it. They have superb stats (all except charisma, but if you poly into a foocubus you get 18 charisma), can poly at will from level 1 and get poly control at level 9. You only need 20 power to turn into ANYTHING, the remainder is made up with nutrition which is easy to recover. Polymorphing also isn't quite an "oLS - if you die from anything other than hp loss you're still dead, and if you have polymorph control (and you do after level 9) you lose max HP. Additionally /oCancel will automatically revert you to human form AND take away max hp if you aren't unchanging or magic resistant. They're the most laughably unbalanced part of the game; see [[User:Qazmlpok]] for two examples. I've spent some time trying an inventoryless game, and it's actually very possible thanks to polyself. Maybe that'll be my third screenshot someday. -- [[User:Qazmlpok\|Qazmlpok]] 00:21, 19 December 2011 (UTC)
		+	::::"About killing gypsies - even Archon can easly kill them, but in fact, only reason for this for me is only keeping neatness - looking for right Gypsy among 50 other - when you going to have a lot wishes - can be really annoying." - There's a really simple solution to this problem. Name gypsies who have given you a wish (with 'C'). There's no need to kill them, and no benefit from doing so if you're doing it via a pet. -[[User:Ion frigate\|Ion frigate]] 02:25, 19 December 2011 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 00:21, 19 December 2011
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	:::You're right. About doppelganger - I played it, and I just wonder - are this role have any disadvantages? Not only giant shoggoth on demand is game breaking, but - for examle - even any form on low level is like amulet of life saving. On level 4, You can just wander around as baby x dragon or something, and - when You die - just polyself again. Also, doppelganger can start with =oPC (I think it's bug - for example, noone can start with /oPolymorph and =oPC). --[[User:S.K.\|S.K.]] 22:43, 18 December 2011 (UTC)		:::You're right. About doppelganger - I played it, and I just wonder - are this role have any disadvantages? Not only giant shoggoth on demand is game breaking, but - for examle - even any form on low level is like amulet of life saving. On level 4, You can just wander around as baby x dragon or something, and - when You die - just polyself again. Also, doppelganger can start with =oPC (I think it's bug - for example, noone can start with /oPolymorph and =oPC). --[[User:S.K.\|S.K.]] 22:43, 18 December 2011 (UTC)
	:::I think it's good idea to forbid any means of polymorph control for doppelgangers in SLASH'EM leaving only chances system ((monster level - your level)/5) --[[User:S.K.\|S.K.]] 22:57, 18 December 2011 (UTC)		:::I think it's good idea to forbid any means of polymorph control for doppelgangers in SLASH'EM leaving only chances system ((monster level - your level)/5) --[[User:S.K.\|S.K.]] 22:57, 18 December 2011 (UTC)
		+	::::Doppelgangers can't #twoweapon. That's about it. They have superb stats (all except charisma, but if you poly into a foocubus you get 18 charisma), can poly at will from level 1 and get poly control at level 9. You only need 20 power to turn into ANYTHING, the remainder is made up with nutrition which is easy to recover. Polymorphing also isn't quite an "oLS - if you die from anything other than hp loss you're still dead, and if you have polymorph control (and you do after level 9) you lose max HP. Additionally /oCancel will automatically revert you to human form AND take away max hp if you aren't unchanging or magic resistant. They're the most laughably unbalanced part of the game; see [[User:Qazmlpok]] for two examples. I've spent some time trying an inventoryless game, and it's actually very possible thanks to polyself. Maybe that'll be my third screenshot someday. -- [[User:Qazmlpok\|Qazmlpok]] 00:21, 19 December 2011 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 22:57, 18 December 2011
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	::It's a big loophole, but SLASH'EM is filled with other such things, and it's no worse than pudding farming in terms of breaking the game and is probably even more boring. Yes, you could get 120 wishes, but once you have a tame Solar and a magic whistle you don't need much more. It's far from foolproof but it's still enough to wipe out almost anything. On the other hand you could just play as a doppelganger and turn into a giant shoggoth on demand - I find that to be exceptionally game breaking. Or you can get up to level 29 as a lawful, pray when you need to be healed, and you have a 66% chance of getting a tame solar without using a single wish. -- [[User:Qazmlpok\|Qazmlpok]] 22:32, 18 December 2011 (UTC)		::It's a big loophole, but SLASH'EM is filled with other such things, and it's no worse than pudding farming in terms of breaking the game and is probably even more boring. Yes, you could get 120 wishes, but once you have a tame Solar and a magic whistle you don't need much more. It's far from foolproof but it's still enough to wipe out almost anything. On the other hand you could just play as a doppelganger and turn into a giant shoggoth on demand - I find that to be exceptionally game breaking. Or you can get up to level 29 as a lawful, pray when you need to be healed, and you have a 66% chance of getting a tame solar without using a single wish. -- [[User:Qazmlpok\|Qazmlpok]] 22:32, 18 December 2011 (UTC)
	:::You're right. About doppelganger - I played it, and I just wonder - are this role have any disadvantages? Not only giant shoggoth on demand is game breaking, but - for examle - even any form on low level is like amulet of life saving. On level 4, You can just wander around as baby x dragon or something, and - when You die - just polyself again. Also, doppelganger can start with =oPC (I think it's bug - for example, noone can start with /oPolymorph and =oPC). --[[User:S.K.\|S.K.]] 22:43, 18 December 2011 (UTC)		:::You're right. About doppelganger - I played it, and I just wonder - are this role have any disadvantages? Not only giant shoggoth on demand is game breaking, but - for examle - even any form on low level is like amulet of life saving. On level 4, You can just wander around as baby x dragon or something, and - when You die - just polyself again. Also, doppelganger can start with =oPC (I think it's bug - for example, noone can start with /oPolymorph and =oPC). --[[User:S.K.\|S.K.]] 22:43, 18 December 2011 (UTC)
		+	:::I think it's good idea to forbid any means of polymorph control for doppelgangers in SLASH'EM leaving only chances system ((monster level - your level)/5) --[[User:S.K.\|S.K.]] 22:57, 18 December 2011 (UTC)