Talk:Prayer - Revision history

Umbire the Phantom: reply + unsigned

2026-03-30T06:46:40Z

reply + unsigned

← Older revision		Revision as of 06:46, 30 March 2026
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	:"No effect" in that case clearly refers to the specific message about the passtune—indeed, it doesn't do anything on its own but signal that the next prayer with that result will teach you said passtune, and it can occur in tandem with other messages that have associated effects such as attribute restoration. --[[User:Umbire the Phantom\|Umbire the Phantom]] ([[User talk:Umbire the Phantom\|talk]]) 22:04, 28 March 2026 (UTC)		:"No effect" in that case clearly refers to the specific message about the passtune—indeed, it doesn't do anything on its own but signal that the next prayer with that result will teach you said passtune, and it can occur in tandem with other messages that have associated effects such as attribute restoration. --[[User:Umbire the Phantom\|Umbire the Phantom]] ([[User talk:Umbire the Phantom\|talk]]) 22:04, 28 March 2026 (UTC)

	You don't think the restore ability effect (I presume) should be mentioned?		You don't think the restore ability effect (I presume) should be mentioned? {{unsigned\|Pyrzax\|2026-03-29T11:05:25}}

			:That would fall under the hero's god addressing [[trouble]]s, and the article for that is in dire need of updating (which I'll take a stab at tonight if I can remember). --[[User:Umbire the Phantom\|Umbire the Phantom]] ([[User talk:Umbire the Phantom\|talk]]) 06:46, 30 March 2026 (UTC)

	== The Killer Bee Shrinks Back! ==		== The Killer Bee Shrinks Back! ==

Pyrzax: /* Benefits of Prayer */

2026-03-29T15:05:25Z

Benefits of Prayer

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	--[[User:Pyrzax\|Pyrzax]] ([[User talk:Pyrzax\|talk]]) 16:18, 28 March 2026 (UTC)		--[[User:Pyrzax\|Pyrzax]] ([[User talk:Pyrzax\|talk]]) 16:18, 28 March 2026 (UTC)
	:"No effect" in that case clearly refers to the specific message about the passtune—indeed, it doesn't do anything on its own but signal that the next prayer with that result will teach you said passtune, and it can occur in tandem with other messages that have associated effects such as attribute restoration. --[[User:Umbire the Phantom\|Umbire the Phantom]] ([[User talk:Umbire the Phantom\|talk]]) 22:04, 28 March 2026 (UTC)		:"No effect" in that case clearly refers to the specific message about the passtune—indeed, it doesn't do anything on its own but signal that the next prayer with that result will teach you said passtune, and it can occur in tandem with other messages that have associated effects such as attribute restoration. --[[User:Umbire the Phantom\|Umbire the Phantom]] ([[User talk:Umbire the Phantom\|talk]]) 22:04, 28 March 2026 (UTC)

			You don't think the restore ability effect (I presume) should be mentioned?

	== The Killer Bee Shrinks Back! ==		== The Killer Bee Shrinks Back! ==

Umbire the Phantom: /* Benefits of Prayer */ place sig at end

2026-03-28T22:05:29Z

Benefits of Prayer: place sig at end

← Older revision		Revision as of 22:05, 28 March 2026
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	:Have a look at entry #2 under [[Prayer#Favors and gifts\|Favors and gifts]]. One of the possible prayer gifts is that your god will bless or uncurse your current weapon as though dipped in holy water. -- [[User:Killian\|Killian]] 15:10, 19 September 2008 (UTC)		:Have a look at entry #2 under [[Prayer#Favors and gifts\|Favors and gifts]]. One of the possible prayer gifts is that your god will bless or uncurse your current weapon as though dipped in holy water. -- [[User:Killian\|Killian]] 15:10, 19 September 2008 (UTC)

	~~--[[User:Pyrzax\|Pyrzax]] ([[User talk:Pyrzax\|talk]]) 16:18, 28 March 2026 (UTC)~~ Regarding Favor #3:		Regarding Favor #3:
	I received this message, and some lost Dexterity was restored, contradicting the "No Effect" notation:		I received this message, and some lost Dexterity was restored, contradicting the "No Effect" notation:
	You begin praying to Anhur. You are surrounded by a shimmering light. You finish your prayer. The potions on the altar glow light blue for a moment. You feel that Anhur is well-pleased. You feel in good health again. The voice of Anhur booms out: "Hark, mortal!" "To enter the castle, thou must play the right tune!"		You begin praying to Anhur. You are surrounded by a shimmering light. You finish your prayer. The potions on the altar glow light blue for a moment. You feel that Anhur is well-pleased. You feel in good health again. The voice of Anhur booms out: "Hark, mortal!" "To enter the castle, thou must play the right tune!"

			--[[User:Pyrzax\|Pyrzax]] ([[User talk:Pyrzax\|talk]]) 16:18, 28 March 2026 (UTC)
	:"No effect" in that case clearly refers to the specific message about the passtune—indeed, it doesn't do anything on its own but signal that the next prayer with that result will teach you said passtune, and it can occur in tandem with other messages that have associated effects such as attribute restoration. --[[User:Umbire the Phantom\|Umbire the Phantom]] ([[User talk:Umbire the Phantom\|talk]]) 22:04, 28 March 2026 (UTC)		:"No effect" in that case clearly refers to the specific message about the passtune—indeed, it doesn't do anything on its own but signal that the next prayer with that result will teach you said passtune, and it can occur in tandem with other messages that have associated effects such as attribute restoration. --[[User:Umbire the Phantom\|Umbire the Phantom]] ([[User talk:Umbire the Phantom\|talk]]) 22:04, 28 March 2026 (UTC)

Umbire the Phantom: reply

2026-03-28T22:04:51Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 22:04, 28 March 2026
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	I received this message, and some lost Dexterity was restored, contradicting the "No Effect" notation:		I received this message, and some lost Dexterity was restored, contradicting the "No Effect" notation:
	You begin praying to Anhur. You are surrounded by a shimmering light. You finish your prayer. The potions on the altar glow light blue for a moment. You feel that Anhur is well-pleased. You feel in good health again. The voice of Anhur booms out: "Hark, mortal!" "To enter the castle, thou must play the right tune!"		You begin praying to Anhur. You are surrounded by a shimmering light. You finish your prayer. The potions on the altar glow light blue for a moment. You feel that Anhur is well-pleased. You feel in good health again. The voice of Anhur booms out: "Hark, mortal!" "To enter the castle, thou must play the right tune!"

			:"No effect" in that case clearly refers to the specific message about the passtune—indeed, it doesn't do anything on its own but signal that the next prayer with that result will teach you said passtune, and it can occur in tandem with other messages that have associated effects such as attribute restoration. --[[User:Umbire the Phantom\|Umbire the Phantom]] ([[User talk:Umbire the Phantom\|talk]]) 22:04, 28 March 2026 (UTC)

	== The Killer Bee Shrinks Back! ==		== The Killer Bee Shrinks Back! ==

Pyrzax: /* Benefits of Prayer */

2026-03-28T16:18:13Z

Benefits of Prayer

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	:Have a look at entry #2 under [[Prayer#Favors and gifts\|Favors and gifts]]. One of the possible prayer gifts is that your god will bless or uncurse your current weapon as though dipped in holy water. -- [[User:Killian\|Killian]] 15:10, 19 September 2008 (UTC)		:Have a look at entry #2 under [[Prayer#Favors and gifts\|Favors and gifts]]. One of the possible prayer gifts is that your god will bless or uncurse your current weapon as though dipped in holy water. -- [[User:Killian\|Killian]] 15:10, 19 September 2008 (UTC)

			--[[User:Pyrzax\|Pyrzax]] ([[User talk:Pyrzax\|talk]]) 16:18, 28 March 2026 (UTC) Regarding Favor #3:
			I received this message, and some lost Dexterity was restored, contradicting the "No Effect" notation:
			You begin praying to Anhur. You are surrounded by a shimmering light. You finish your prayer. The potions on the altar glow light blue for a moment. You feel that Anhur is well-pleased. You feel in good health again. The voice of Anhur booms out: "Hark, mortal!" "To enter the castle, thou must play the right tune!"

	== The Killer Bee Shrinks Back! ==		== The Killer Bee Shrinks Back! ==

D4 wryyyy: /* Unsuccessful Prayers */ new section

2021-12-15T06:22:04Z

Unsuccessful Prayers: new section

← Older revision		Revision as of 06:22, 15 December 2021
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	Hexers seem reluctant to publish their methods perhaps for fear that game designers will futher encrypt data in subsequent versions of the game.		Hexers seem reluctant to publish their methods perhaps for fear that game designers will futher encrypt data in subsequent versions of the game.
	--[[User:Barb.Neu\|Barb.Neu]] ([[User talk:Barb.Neu\|talk]]) 17:42, 6 May 2015 (UTC)		--[[User:Barb.Neu\|Barb.Neu]] ([[User talk:Barb.Neu\|talk]]) 17:42, 6 May 2015 (UTC)

			== Unsuccessful Prayers ==

			The table cell on "Standing on a different god's altar and praying as normal" was dangerously wrong. I fixed it to the best of my knowledge, but it needs to be completed. The entry previously read "You receive an alignment clue (see above), then lose one alignment point. No other effects. Your prayer timeout is not incremented."

			"No other effects" is DEFINITELY wrong, since I lost my protection immediately when I tried it.
			The "alignment clue" you receive is not the same as when e.g. you apply a [[stethoscope]] to yourself; when I prayed at a cross-aligned altar (with no water, while safe to pray), I got a message that Huan Ti was displeased with me, but afterwards my stethoscope still revealed that I was piously aligned. I believe this suggests that alignment is indeed decreased by one, but the message relates to your god's anger, NOT your alignment record. I continued praying repeatedly and got punished and eventually killed, which seems to corroborate this idea.

			I've been source-diving on this but I'm in the middle of comparing 3.4.3 and 3.6.2 (my current version), I haven't had C since highschool, and I have to be at work in a few hours... good luck! [[User:D4 wryyyy\|D4 wryyyy]] ([[User talk:D4 wryyyy\|talk]]) 06:22, 15 December 2021 (UTC)

Cathartes: /* Prayer protection racket */ reply

2021-12-15T06:09:07Z

Prayer protection racket: reply

← Older revision		Revision as of 06:09, 15 December 2021
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	:please do note this is very scummy cheating, bad advice, and useless on NAO. additionally, several pieces of misinformation here could be considered no better than opinion, e.g. that bar-bars "need" a boh. others, e.g. "lightest helm may be a dented pot" are incomplete or just wrong. an elven leather helm is lighter and has the same AC, not to mention can be enchanted to +5. what's the protocol for deleting something from a talk page? i know it's rare. [[User:D4 wryyyy\|D4 wryyyy]] ([[User talk:D4 wryyyy\|talk]]) 05:54, 15 December 2021 (UTC)		:please do note this is very scummy cheating, bad advice, and useless on NAO. additionally, several pieces of misinformation here could be considered no better than opinion, e.g. that bar-bars "need" a boh. others, e.g. "lightest helm may be a dented pot" are incomplete or just wrong. an elven leather helm is lighter and has the same AC, not to mention can be enchanted to +5. what's the protocol for deleting something from a talk page? i know it's rare. [[User:D4 wryyyy\|D4 wryyyy]] ([[User talk:D4 wryyyy\|talk]]) 05:54, 15 December 2021 (UTC)

			::Don't worry about it, it's just an old comment on a talk page. Talk pages don't present the appearance of being the official voice of the Wiki like the corresponding articles are, since they clearly consist of comments written by random people. It's not expected that talk pages will contain good information. [[User:Cathartes\|Cathartes]] ([[User talk:Cathartes\|talk]]) 06:08, 15 December 2021 (UTC)

	== Hexer cheating ==		== Hexer cheating ==

D4 wryyyy at 06:03, 15 December 2021

2021-12-15T06:03:28Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 06:03, 15 December 2021
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			== lost protection ==

	I think that I lost my priest-purchased protection plan(tm) because I prayed too soon, but I can't find any mention of protection loss on the priest page or this page. Can we add it, or did I lose my Protection for some other reason?		I think that I lost my priest-purchased protection plan(tm) because I prayed too soon, but I can't find any mention of protection loss on the priest page or this page. Can we add it, or did I lose my Protection for some other reason?
	— [[User:Qwip\|Qwip]] 17:20, 21 September 2007 (UTC)		— [[User:Qwip\|Qwip]] 17:20, 21 September 2007 (UTC)

D4 wryyyy: /* Prayer protection racket */

2021-12-15T05:54:44Z

Prayer protection racket

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	--[[User:Barb.Neu\|Barb.Neu]] ([[User talk:Barb.Neu\|talk]]) 12:07, 27 April 2015 (UTC)		--[[User:Barb.Neu\|Barb.Neu]] ([[User talk:Barb.Neu\|talk]]) 12:07, 27 April 2015 (UTC)

			:please do note this is very scummy cheating, bad advice, and useless on NAO. additionally, several pieces of misinformation here could be considered no better than opinion, e.g. that bar-bars "need" a boh. others, e.g. "lightest helm may be a dented pot" are incomplete or just wrong. an elven leather helm is lighter and has the same AC, not to mention can be enchanted to +5. what's the protocol for deleting something from a talk page? i know it's rare. [[User:D4 wryyyy\|D4 wryyyy]] ([[User talk:D4 wryyyy\|talk]]) 05:54, 15 December 2021 (UTC)

			== Hexer cheating ==
	A hexer has the options of hexing cash, cloning magic lamps etc by hexing the stack quantity, raising wand enchantments to 7F (higher values are negative) and hexing weapon and armor enchanments but checksum encryption deters only morphing one item into another item. The game designers may have their own reasons for using selective deterence invoving the wand of wishing.		A hexer has the options of hexing cash, cloning magic lamps etc by hexing the stack quantity, raising wand enchantments to 7F (higher values are negative) and hexing weapon and armor enchanments but checksum encryption deters only morphing one item into another item. The game designers may have their own reasons for using selective deterence invoving the wand of wishing.
	Summoning enemies with a hexed up wand makes consequences that may not all be wanted.		Summoning enemies with a hexed up wand makes consequences that may not all be wanted.

Barb.Neu at 17:42, 6 May 2015

2015-05-06T17:42:15Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 17:42, 6 May 2015
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	== Prayer protection racket ==		== Prayer protection racket ==

	~~My results in 3~~.~~4.3 with gaining protection from prayer differ from~~ those in the ~~Favors and Gifts table~~.		The advice to break mirrors to avoid crowning applies only to those who choose not to restore backup save files and who already have high luck and alignment record.
			For those who do restore backups and are low level players in Minetown with an identified and blessed magic lamp and perhaps an aligned temple and an icebox, the advice might be different.

	~~To keep from getting crowned~~ (8+), ~~I broke one mirror which resulted~~ in getting ~~spellbooks (7).~~		Before wishing or sacrificing for wishless artefacts like Frost Brand (or much else in the game) becomes almost reasonable, both Luck and the alignment record need to be high. The luckstone is needed. Credit cloning is highly desirable for buying Priest protection and perhaps for buying improved Luck or alignment records.
	~~Breaking~~ a ~~second mirror resulted~~ in ~~Castle tune messages~~ (4).		Sacrificing and accepting a lesser gift in the early stages, rather than restoring a backup, helps to raise your alignment record and progressively improve your chances of getting a 1 in 8 shot at sacrifice protection or neutral artefacts (spellbooks seem to be favored over these initially).
	~~Feeding mutiple gems to an aligned unicorn got this back up to protection gift~~(6).		Making one further sacrifice after getting the conciliation message will sometimes get you a luck increase (four leaf clover) or more rarely a wishless neutral artefact like Frost Brand.

	~~Now each time I win a protection level it leaves me getting golden glow (3) or tune (4) messages afterwards.~~		Both killing and sacrificing raises the alignment record provided negative behaviours are avoided.
	~~Carrying~~ the ~~luckstone makes no difference~~.

	~~Buying >200XL from~~ the ~~priest after each protection gift from prayer seems to~~ be ~~necessary before farming further protection gifts and its easier than feeding unicorns~~.		A low level Barbarian needs the amulet of reflection and a bag of holding but Sokoban provides only one of those. For carrying capacity Barb needs GDSM for less weight and gauntlets of power and that bag again but a magic lamp gives only one wish so we have a problem in the launch sequence Houston.

			Confused enchantment scrolls may help raise a beginners strength and or dexterity, both help carrying capacity.
			A non spellcaster's lightest helm may be a dented pot, heh.

	~~Maybe this will help anyone who is silly enough to try ;)~~
	--[[User:Barb.Neu\|Barb.Neu]] ([[User talk:Barb.Neu\|talk]]) 12:07, 27 April 2015 (UTC)		--[[User:Barb.Neu\|Barb.Neu]] ([[User talk:Barb.Neu\|talk]]) 12:07, 27 April 2015 (UTC)

	~~Further reading~~ and ~~testing confirms the wiki info~~ and the ~~effectiveness~~ of ~~the luckstone~~.		A hexer has the options of hexing cash, cloning magic lamps etc by hexing the stack quantity, raising wand enchantments to 7F (higher values are negative) and hexing weapon and armor enchanments but checksum encryption deters only morphing one item into another item. The game designers may have their own reasons for using selective deterence invoving the wand of wishing.
	~~This is~~ not ~~about~~ the ~~regular racket~~ of ~~buying protection, it is about prayer protection that bypasses AC limits allowing less enchantments to be used and more weight carried as a result~~. ~~Practical stuff~~.		Summoning enemies with a hexed up wand makes consequences that may not all be wanted.
			Hexing the stack size of corpses in an icebox for factory scale sacrifice can reduce those consequences.
			--[[User:Barb.Neu\|Barb.Neu]] ([[User talk:Barb.Neu\|talk]]) 03:37, 29 April 2015 (UTC)

	~~The advice given~~ to ~~break mirrors and jump~~ in ~~Sokoban is helpful only to those who don't restore backups.~~		Hexers seem reluctant to publish their methods perhaps for fear that game designers will futher encrypt data in subsequent versions of the game.
	~~For the many who do, just keep restoring until you get the protection gift (or spellbook) from prayer.~~		--[[User:Barb.Neu\|Barb.Neu]] ([[User talk:Barb.Neu\|talk]]) 17:42, 6 May 2015 (UTC)
	~~While it is obvious to do this, it is also obvious to just follow~~ the ~~wiki advice and break mirrors and jump in Sokoban for gosh sakes.~~

	~~The learning curve in this~~ game ~~is challenge enough without adding complexity that is unneeded by many or most players. Perhaps it should be commented accordingly.~~
	~~I was expecting the unlimited AC challenge to be extra difficult, instead it was ordinary, no extra complexities involved.~~

	~~Thank you for the wiki too, it is usually a reliable time saver~~.
	--[[User:Barb.Neu\|Barb.Neu]] ([[User talk:Barb.Neu\|talk]]) 03:37, ~~29 April~~ 2015 (UTC)