Talk:Property - Revision history

Kernigh: /* Attribute/property/intrinsic */ Misspelled 'intrinsic' as 'inStrinsic' in my own comment, 2006.

2007-12-10T00:16:16Z

‎Attribute/property/intrinsic: Misspelled 'intrinsic' as 'inStrinsic' in my own comment, 2006.

Kernigh: /* Integer/Constants */ Move the constants to footnotes, or to a separate section; or delete them and link to prop.h and youprop.h --~~~~

2007-12-10T00:00:44Z

‎Integer/Constants: Move the constants to footnotes, or to a separate section; or delete them and link to prop.h and youprop.h --~~~~

Giz: /* Integer/Constants */

2006-12-01T09:42:02Z

‎Integer/Constants

Giz: Integer/Constants

2006-12-01T09:41:33Z

Integer/Constants

Jayt: /* Attribute/property/intrinsic */

2006-07-15T10:59:49Z

‎Attribute/property/intrinsic

Kernigh: Some properties are not instrinsics.

2006-07-14T23:55:48Z

Some properties are not instrinsics.

Jayt: answer; Attribute/property/intrinsic difference

2006-07-10T12:53:34Z

answer; Attribute/property/intrinsic difference

ZeroOne: hunger, walking through walls

2006-07-10T10:36:04Z

hunger, walking through walls

New page

How is [[hunger]] a property? I thought it is a number telling how hungry you are, not a boolean. Also, I believe that "walking through walls" is called ''phasing'', although I cannot remember where I read that. --[[User:ZeroOne|ZeroOne]] 10:36, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

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 If this is correct, I would move this page to [[Intrinsic]], or maybe [[Intrinsic property]], as this term is more widely understood in [[RGRN]] and elsewhere. Actually I prefer the latter, as the term "extrinsic property" needs explaining too. --[[User:Jayt|Jayt]] 12:53, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
-: I think that there are some properties that are ''not'' instrinsics. I feel that an [[instrinsic]] or [[Wiktionary:intrinsic]] is something internal to the [[hero]] or [[monster]], inseparable from it. For example, I might obtain instrinsic [[poison resistance]] after eating a [[shrieker]] corpse, but it would not be intrinsic if I wore an [[amulet versus poison]]. Most of the properties ''can'' be intrinsics (of [[polymorph]] into something or eat a [[ring]]) but at least one, [[life saving]], would never be. --[[User:Kernigh|Kernigh]] 23:55, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
+: I think that there are some properties that are ''not'' instrinsics. I feel that an [[intrinsic]] or [[Wiktionary:intrinsic]] is something internal to the [[hero]] or [[monster]], inseparable from it. For example, I might obtain instrinsic [[poison resistance]] after eating a [[shrieker]] corpse, but it would not be intrinsic if I wore an [[amulet versus poison]]. Most of the properties ''can'' be intrinsics (of [[polymorph]] into something or eat a [[ring]]) but at least one, [[life saving]], would never be. --[[User:Kernigh|Kernigh]] 23:55, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
 ::Yes, those are what I mean by extrinsic properties. I've heard people call them "extrinsic intrinsics", but this is unnecessarily confusing. So, OK, this page can happily remain as Property, but perhaps you could split the list into sections like these:

← Older revision		Revision as of 00:00, 10 December 2007
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	Wouldn't it be better to show foot notes instead of th constants ? [[User:Giz\|Giz]] 09:42, 1 December 2006 (UTC)giz		Wouldn't it be better to show foot notes instead of th constants ? [[User:Giz\|Giz]] 09:42, 1 December 2006 (UTC)giz
		+
		+	: Move the constants to footnotes, or to a separate section; or delete them and link to [[prop.h]] and [[youprop.h]] --[[User:Kernigh\|Kernigh]] 00:00, 10 December 2007 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 09:42, 1 December 2006
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	== Integer/Constants ==		== Integer/Constants ==

−	Wouldn't it be better to show foot notes instead of th constants ?	+	Wouldn't it be better to show foot notes instead of th constants ? [[User:Giz\|Giz]] 09:42, 1 December 2006 (UTC)giz

← Older revision		Revision as of 09:41, 1 December 2006
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	::Those categories should be distinct. --[[User:Jayt\|Jayt]] 10:59, 15 July 2006 (UTC)		::Those categories should be distinct. --[[User:Jayt\|Jayt]] 10:59, 15 July 2006 (UTC)
		+
		+	== Integer/Constants ==
		+
		+	Wouldn't it be better to show foot notes instead of th constants ?

← Older revision		Revision as of 10:59, 15 July 2006
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	: I think that there are some properties that are ''not'' instrinsics. I feel that an [[instrinsic]] or [[Wiktionary:intrinsic]] is something internal to the [[hero]] or [[monster]], inseparable from it. For example, I might obtain instrinsic [[poison resistance]] after eating a [[shrieker]] corpse, but it would not be intrinsic if I wore an [[amulet versus poison]]. Most of the properties ''can'' be intrinsics (of [[polymorph]] into something or eat a [[ring]]) but at least one, [[life saving]], would never be. --[[User:Kernigh\|Kernigh]] 23:55, 14 July 2006 (UTC)		: I think that there are some properties that are ''not'' instrinsics. I feel that an [[instrinsic]] or [[Wiktionary:intrinsic]] is something internal to the [[hero]] or [[monster]], inseparable from it. For example, I might obtain instrinsic [[poison resistance]] after eating a [[shrieker]] corpse, but it would not be intrinsic if I wore an [[amulet versus poison]]. Most of the properties ''can'' be intrinsics (of [[polymorph]] into something or eat a [[ring]]) but at least one, [[life saving]], would never be. --[[User:Kernigh\|Kernigh]] 23:55, 14 July 2006 (UTC)
		+	::Yes, those are what I mean by extrinsic properties. I've heard people call them "extrinsic intrinsics", but this is unnecessarily confusing. So, OK, this page can happily remain as Property, but perhaps you could split the list into sections like these:
		+
		+	::# Properties available as intrinsics (e.g. resistances)
		+	::# Properties available as extrinsics only (e.g. water walking, life saving)
		+	::# Properties available by polymorphing only (e.g. swimming, phasing)
		+	::# Physical properties (wounded legs, strangulation, slippery fingers, nausea, invulnerability)
		+
		+	::Those categories should be distinct. --[[User:Jayt\|Jayt]] 10:59, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 23:55, 14 July 2006
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	If this is correct, I would move this page to [[Intrinsic]], or maybe [[Intrinsic property]], as this term is more widely understood in [[RGRN]] and elsewhere. Actually I prefer the latter, as the term "extrinsic property" needs explaining too. --[[User:Jayt\|Jayt]] 12:53, 10 July 2006 (UTC)		If this is correct, I would move this page to [[Intrinsic]], or maybe [[Intrinsic property]], as this term is more widely understood in [[RGRN]] and elsewhere. Actually I prefer the latter, as the term "extrinsic property" needs explaining too. --[[User:Jayt\|Jayt]] 12:53, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
		+
		+	: I think that there are some properties that are ''not'' instrinsics. I feel that an [[instrinsic]] or [[Wiktionary:intrinsic]] is something internal to the [[hero]] or [[monster]], inseparable from it. For example, I might obtain instrinsic [[poison resistance]] after eating a [[shrieker]] corpse, but it would not be intrinsic if I wore an [[amulet versus poison]]. Most of the properties ''can'' be intrinsics (of [[polymorph]] into something or eat a [[ring]]) but at least one, [[life saving]], would never be. --[[User:Kernigh\|Kernigh]] 23:55, 14 July 2006 (UTC)

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		+	==Hunger==
		+
	How is [[hunger]] a property? I thought it is a number telling how hungry you are, not a boolean. Also, I believe that "walking through walls" is called ''phasing'', although I cannot remember where I read that. --[[User:ZeroOne\|ZeroOne]] 10:36, 10 July 2006 (UTC)		How is [[hunger]] a property? I thought it is a number telling how hungry you are, not a boolean. Also, I believe that "walking through walls" is called ''phasing'', although I cannot remember where I read that. --[[User:ZeroOne\|ZeroOne]] 10:36, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
		+	:Hunger can refer to both the normal state of needing nutrition, and also an intrinsic property given by the [[ring of hunger]], which causes you to burn nutrition faster. I've always called walking through walls phasing too, although the word "phase" appears in this context only in a source comment ([[monflag.h#line77]]) and in an unimplemented feature ([[dig.c#line1530]]). In-game, this property is revealed to you via enlightenment as "You can walk through walls." --[[User:Jayt\|Jayt]] 12:53, 10 July 2006 (UTC)
		+
		+	==Attribute/property/intrinsic==
		+
		+	I've seen these terms used interchangably, and I'm still not entirely clear on the difference. I thought attributes were just the six status line stats (St Dx Co In Wi Ch), but the enlightenment list mixes up a lot of things, and calls them attributes!
		+
		+	Current Attributes:
		+
		+	You are fervently aligned.
		+	You are fire resistant.
		+	You are cold resistant.
		+	You are petrification resistant.
		+	You hunger rapidly.
		+	You can jump.
		+	You can survive without air.
		+	You can walk through walls.
		+	You are polymorphed into a xorn.
		+	You are lucky.
		+	You can not safely pray.
		+
		+	The term "property" is not widely used in the source (intrinsic seems preferred). Tell me if this is right: intrinsics and properties are the same thing, and attributes comprise all the properties plus various things recorded in the "u" object/struct, which don't have to be boolean ([[cmd.c#line830]]).
		+
		+	If this is correct, I would move this page to [[Intrinsic]], or maybe [[Intrinsic property]], as this term is more widely understood in [[RGRN]] and elsewhere. Actually I prefer the latter, as the term "extrinsic property" needs explaining too. --[[User:Jayt\|Jayt]] 12:53, 10 July 2006 (UTC)