User:Umbire the Phantom/YANI - Revision history

Umbire the Phantom at 14:24, 16 January 2026

2026-01-16T14:24:15Z

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Umbire the Phantom: /* Cavefolk */

2026-01-15T22:57:57Z

‎Cavefolk

Umbire the Phantom: /* Design principles */ spacing

2026-01-15T22:50:11Z

‎Design principles: spacing

Umbire the Phantom: /* Ideas implemented */ doc another implementation

2026-01-15T22:48:01Z

‎Ideas implemented: doc another implementation

Umbire the Phantom: /* Ice statue */

2025-10-28T08:30:30Z

‎Ice statue

Umbire the Phantom: intro notes + ratlings

2025-10-28T07:54:30Z

intro notes + ratlings

Umbire the Phantom: batch of additions and tweaks

2025-10-25T19:08:35Z

batch of additions and tweaks

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Umbire the Phantom: /* Revomer */

2025-08-03T15:50:30Z

‎Revomer

Umbire the Phantom at 13:02, 3 August 2025

2025-08-03T13:02:36Z

Umbire the Phantom: /* Ice statue */

2025-08-03T13:02:15Z

‎Ice statue

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 ** Perhaps allow them to make their own hide armor?
 * [[Annam]] seems a bit more on theme for a nemesis versus [[Chromatic Dragon|Tiamat]].
 ====Knight====

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 # '''''Keep it simple, silly.'''''<br>• I'm not the most experienced coder, and even better coders than me (read: all of them) hit a wall in making C do what it wants sooner or later, let alone with a roguelike that's Like This. What it's been ''made'' to do is an achievement in itself&mdash;but even so, I don't wanna get too overambitious, especially not until I find some level of footing from which I can tackle higher-difficulty concepts. That doesn't I don't have some quite novel ideas lined up, simply that I'm trying to take it slow.<br>• This also means that, while there is no desire to ''eliminate'' any conducts from attainability, conduct feasibility will have to take a backseat to make sure the game actually functions on the base "do a normal run" level before making considerations to that end.
 # '''''Flavor is the spice of life.'''''<br>• The plot, at the end of the day, is but so much window dressing for a hack-and-slash. That doesn't mean we can't make make various monsters, items and features more memorable.<br>• At mininmum, I'm thinking the role quests can have just a little more variance besides "kill this one BBEG". Just ''how'' much is something I'll have to work out gradually.<br>• Side branches are something dependent on the length of the dungeon, and we might have to do some SLASH'EM-style chicanery if I can't narrow down the amount of branches I want to fit in.<br>• I could simply say "make boring things interesting" but that's so vague and subjective as to be unhelpful, and there's a lot to be said for monsters performing "basic" roles&mdash;getting you used to group fights, teaching you the value of spacing, things of that nature. To that end, the play is gonna be "make what currently exists more distinct".
-# '''''Removal is a last resort.'''''<br>• I'm already hesitant to resort to "deletionism" or consolidation as a first course of action, and it doesn't strike me as useful to throw out something without thoroughly examining it first.<br>• Sometimes it takes time for the right opening to appear that gels with an object or monster's role&mdash;if it ain't fixed, don't break it.<br>• "Last resort" =/= "never do this"&mdash;while deleted stuff can be restored later, I'd rather work ''around'' it than ''without'' it if it's feasible to do so. If it's not, then we'll adjust accordingly.<br>• This numbered point refers primarily to existing vanilla ''NetHack''stuff&mdash;variant stuff is something I can cherry pick a bit more, so it'll be easier to focus on desired changes to begin with.
+# '''''Removal is a last resort.'''''<br>• I'm already hesitant to resort to "deletionism" or consolidation as a first course of action, and it doesn't strike me as useful to throw out something without thoroughly examining it first.<br>• Sometimes it takes time for the right opening to appear that gels with an object or monster's role&mdash;if it ain't fixed, don't break it.<br>• "Last resort" =/= "never do this"&mdash;while deleted stuff can be restored later, I'd rather work ''around'' it than ''without'' it if it's feasible to do so. If it's not, then we'll adjust accordingly.<br>• This numbered point refers primarily to existing vanilla ''NetHack'' stuff&mdash;variant stuff is something I can cherry pick a bit more, so it'll be easier to focus on desired changes to begin with.
 ==Mechanical inspirations==

← Older revision		Revision as of 22:48, 15 January 2026
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	All links point to the YANI archive unless otherwise noted.		All links point to the YANI archive unless otherwise noted.

		+	* [https://nethack-yanis.github.io/yanis/1384.html #1384]: Rope golems drop leashes, bullwhips and grappling hooks upon death. This was brainstormed alongside PavelB and carlarc: leash drops were a part of the [[biodiversity patch]] and so already applied as death drops in SlashTHEM, but bullwhips and grappling hooks were especially uncommon and seemed logical for their usage of rope. Implemented for 3.7.0 in {{commit\|9e666b75f63eca7e537f55ed8c02ce31ef9434f0}} and the much later {{commit\|a4e032762f45f18700bba058fdd37caa0b53ec29}}. Woo.
	* [https://nethack-yanis.github.io/yanis/4505.html #4505]: Shops run by drow shopkeepers should always be unlit rooms. Implemented in [[EvilHack]] (which I suggested this for, though I doubt I was the only one to suggest it either) as part of [https://github.com/k21971/EvilHack/commit/52369bf0f2a026b47e6ecd3210607d7fb598e74a commit 52369bf]. Yay!		* [https://nethack-yanis.github.io/yanis/4505.html #4505]: Shops run by drow shopkeepers should always be unlit rooms. Implemented in [[EvilHack]] (which I suggested this for, though I doubt I was the only one to suggest it either) as part of [https://github.com/k21971/EvilHack/commit/52369bf0f2a026b47e6ecd3210607d7fb598e74a commit 52369bf]. Yay!

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 * Material: Ice
 * Uses: Fire will cause the statue to melt into a square of shallow water, while a 'trapped' ice statue will "thaw" into the monster in question.
-** A hero or monster dying to a cryolisk or a strong enough cold attack makes one of these - they can also randomly generate in <insert ice branch here>, the icy floors of Gehennom, and rarely the main dungeon.<ref>Hey bhaak, can I borrow [[Sheol]] for a month or two?</ref>
+** A hero or monster dying to a cryolisk or a strong enough cold attack makes one of these, with much higher odds if the monster is a [[water elemental]] or something similar&mdash;they can also randomly generate in <insert ice branch here>, the icy floors of Gehennom, and rarely the main dungeon.<ref>Hey bhaak, can I borrow [[Sheol]] for a month or two?</ref>
 ==New-to-the-variant artifacts==

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 =Introductory notes=
-Formatting this from the Lumapad is gonna take some time, so it'll be a while before things're up and running to the point I'd be fine with letting people contribute so that they can properly be attributed - this is a sort of problem I had with the Hardfought Etherpad for a bit. If you wanna see that and peek at the stuff I'm moving, [https://www.hardfought.org/etherpad/p/Lumapad here you go].
+...alright so I the move from the Lumapad has been overwith for some time, and this page just needs a bit of TLC to get to where I'd be fine with letting people contribute so that they can properly be attributed. If you wanna peek at the stuff I was moving, [https://www.hardfought.org/etherpad/p/Lumapad here you go].
 In the meantime, may as well lay the ground rules for anyone agreeing to pitch in:
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 * Notes:
 ** There needs to be SOME kinda perk in exchange for the hunger property&mdash;hobbits have bigger stomachs in general, giants have regeneration, but what should gnolls have...? The "carrion" idea is meant to be a push towards that to start.
 ===Unnamed serpentfolk===
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 ** XL 1: Infravision
 ** XL 3: Poison resistance
-** XL 15: <Swimming/water walking> (they are ''half'' a snake)
+** XL 15: <Swimming/water walking> (they ''are'' "half" a snake)
 *** Initially was the former at XL 10 but might need to sit on this a while
 * Unique traits:
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      Playable race additions
      Formic (Go team a!)

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 ** Confers: illness
 ** Other traits: Animal, hostile
-** Notes: None
+** Notes:
 ===Aberrants===

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 *** God knows if I'll bother with techniques at all, though. If there was a way to implement them without potentially sacrificing ''too much'' balance...
 *** The "named rooms" thing had potential, as did descriptions of paintings and such. (Reminds me a bit of Dwarf Fortress actually...) I wanna see if I can make that work on a per-room basis, possibly allowing the use of [[near look]] {{kbd|:}} to view the ceiling and/or walls in each room at the player's leisure.
-** NerfHack... well, it similarly has some appealing formula changes, if you can find them buried beneath all the even-more-reactive-and-excessive over-nerfing that the dev carried over from Hack'EM and proceeded to double down on. When it got to the point of nerfing a strategy that hothraxxa used to ascend immediately after the fact&ndash;not even getting into how that nearly almost didn't happen on account of a game bug screwing him out of at least one such ascension&ndash;I think that was ultimately the watershed moment that's likely to taint its perception forever. Point being: It's got some good ideas that should've been given more room to breathe, especially with all the "seemingly spiting the player for being good at the game" factors. On which note, maaaaaaybe don't do alla that myself.
+** NerfHack... well, it similarly has some appealing formula changes, if you can find them buried beneath all the even-more-reactive-and-excessive over-nerfing that the dev carried over from Hack'EM and proceeded to double down on. When it got to the point of nerfing a strategy that hothraxxa<ref>The vampire guy.</ref> used to ascend immediately after the fact&ndash;not even getting into how that nearly almost didn't happen on account of a game bug screwing him out of at least one such ascension&ndash;I think that was ultimately the watershed moment that's likely to taint its perception forever. Point being: It's got some good ideas that should've been given more room to breathe, especially with all the "seemingly spiting the player for being good at the game" factors. On which note, maaaaaaybe don't do alla that myself.
 ** EvilHack and xNetHack are also candidates&mdash;both have particular methods of spicing up the dungeon and its denizens, as well as the starting races, that I quite enjoy! If I had to assign arbitrary advantages, though, xnh has the "edge" in regards to handling skills and giving the existing vanilla races a guaranteed skill they can level, while Evil's "edge" is in the expanded item selection, role differentiation and additional artifacts. For how I may often disagree with K2 regarding his outlook on difficulty, it's clear he more often than not knows how to curate it.
 ** dNetHack and its offspring have the above beat in several ways, particularly in regards to role differentiation and artifacts, but conversely are... """held back""", let's say, by several factors&mdash;primarily the limitations of 3.4.3 as a foundation, the amount of code required to make its highly unique shit work also making future endeavors cumbersome, and the kludge involved in coding those features combined with the relative coding inexperience of the dev (sorry Chris, you know I love ya).