Talk:Player monster

Player monsters in the Valley of the Dead

Some people report live player monsters in the Valley. How can that happen? They are only ever created in Src:Ref/final_level for the Astral plane, and Source:Sp_lev.c#line815 for special level loading. But I don't see any player monsters in gehennom.des. --Tjr (talk) 20:04, 9 July 2012 (UTC)

I've definitely seen this. I'm not sure, but I think it might have something to do with the des file. I'm not seeing anything in it that suggests why, though; what code is called to place objects and monsters as specified in the .des? That seems like it'd be a good place to start. Perhaps something strange occurs like the code trying to place one of those player monster corpses in an invalid location, getting confused, and placing the monster instead of the corpse. Basically, the Valley of the Dead sometimes has anomalous player monsters, and it's also the only place in the game where player monster corpses are explicitly placed. These would seem to be related. -Ion frigate (talk) 05:22, 10 July 2012 (UTC)

Also, maybe these corpses are being revived somehow, maybe always on the first turn after they're created? It's a long shot, but it doesn't seem impossible. -Ion frigate (talk) 05:26, 10 July 2012 (UTC)

Could it be caused by something in the code for revival? 108.196.206.15 21:33, 11 July 2012 (UTC)

Maybe it was a valley of the dead bones file where the previous player revived some player monsters (undead turning or similar means), then got himself killed? The VotD is eligible to leave bones, so that should be possible. --Bluescreenofdeath (talk) 11:18, 4 December 2013 (UTC)

It just happened to me. "Really attack the knight? [no/yes]" No bones in sight. It's happened once before as well. A knight as well. I'd say it's a bug somewhere.--50.45.152.170 05:49, 13 December 2014 (UTC)

Re: Elf Player Monsters

Did elf player monsters ever appear at any point in any version? If so, there's no note of it on their page. If not, it could probably be removed from said list, though iunno for sure. --Umbire the Phantom (talk) 01:23, 19 March 2019 (UTC)

Gender disparity

If I read mplayer.c correctly, the player monsters on the Astral Plane are almost exclusively male, with the sole exception being "priestess" and "cavewoman"... --Bluescreenofdeath (talk) 11:05, 19 March 2019 (UTC)

More like those are the only cases where the class terms are explicitly gendered, and thus the only ones that would HAVE to change to reflect such (i.e. female "barbarian" = barbarian, female "caveman" = cavewoman). At least that's what I'm reading --Umbire the Phantom (talk) 11:46, 19 March 2019 (UTC)

Generation by growing up - equipment?

If a quest guardian grows up, do they keep their original equipment or get those specified for a player monster of the appropriate type? -Actual-nh (talk) 16:12, 22 April 2021 (UTC)

For grins, just ran a test on 3.7.0 vanilla NetHack. Spawned a Student, let it pick up a blessed +7 dagger, put on a ring of conflict, and spawned a bunch of monsters and let it go on a killing spree until it grew up into an Archeologist. It's inventory won't change upon growing up, it keeps what it has already. It's kind of odd how player monsters and their gear is determined, it's all handled in src/mplayer.c - there are special considerations if the player monster spawns on astral plane versus not. In vanilla you'll almost never see a live player monster until you get to astral plane, but there are special cases (Perseus' statue on Medusa's level if you cast stone to flesh on it, etc). K2 (talk) 18:25, 22 April 2021 (UTC)

Leveling up doesn't magically change equipment. --Umbire the Phantom (talk) 16:21, 22 April 2021 (UTC)

Makes sense. My confusion is what the "not on the Astral Plane" is there for - left over from when monsters reverse genocided with inventory? -Actual-nh (talk) 16:25, 22 April 2021 (UTC)

You more than likely misread, because I'd just gotten done clarifying that generation rules primarily applied to those on the Astral Plane. --Umbire the Phantom (talk) 17:45, 22 April 2021 (UTC)

Currently, yes, but there is code (see above) for equipment for spawns not on the astral plane. As I said, I'm guessing it's a leftover, at least in vanilla. -Actual-nh (talk) 20:31, 22 April 2021 (UTC)

No, turns out it's actually special casing for Medusa's statue collection. May be potentially worth adding. --Umbire the Phantom (talk) 20:43, 22 April 2021 (UTC)

There are a few situations where player monsters can appear other than the Astral Plane, such as Newt on the Wizard quest boss floor. Variants may make use of it too. - Andrio Celos (talk) 04:27, 23 April 2021 (UTC)