NetHackWiki:Ask an expert/Archive6

NetHack can be a monstrously complicated game, so it's not unnatural to seek help from time to time. Conventional sources of wisdom are:

• The Oracle - the intended source of information for unspoiled players.
• rec.games.roguelike.nethack
• #nethack on irc.freenode.net

Additionally, a number of knowledgeable players are active on this wiki, so feel free to ask a question below and somebody is sure to answer it eventually. If you want to discuss a topic that is not about NetHack, please discuss it at the community portal.

Archives of this page: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5.

Start a new section on the bottom of this page for each question.

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The path to ascension

I haven't gotten THAT far yet, been playing for about a month now, and the furthest I've gotten to is Dlevel 22 with a lvl14 Babarian. (I just found out yesterday how to use the #enhance command. No I am not joking, I actually played about 50 hours without knowing how to raise my skills).

Alright, basically, could someone give me a slight guide to the Dungeons? Like, you start in the DoD and around level 3-5 you can go to the GM, there is the big room in between... etc.

Just a general guide as to where you go through ever since you begin the game, until ascension.

As always, the answer's "it depends". I tend to go to Minetown as early as possible to buy protection before leveling up too much, but many others do Sokoban first and so on. The article about Standard strategy might be a start. Also some roles' quests are easy and gain you much so should be done early, whereas others are mostly useless and best delayed, so best read the article dealing with your role. Also helpful: a map in ASCII, and a hand-drawn one: http://modcult.org/image/150 --62.80.22.186 10:54, September 14, 2010 (UTC)

I learned with Maniac's Ascension Guide.Tjr 15:51, September 14, 2010 (UTC)

Keeping a pet

What would you say is best? Having a tame Large dog/Cat/Warhorse, no pet, or pet monster?

I find keeping a Dog/Cat to be more trouble than it's worth. First, they attack peacefuls and creatures you'd rather keep alive. They also eat bodies you'd possibly like to eat (floating eyes, normal bodies when you're hungry, etc).

They also kill shopkeepers, priests and guards in Minetown.

They get lost constantly, and you have to keep going back to get them before you go down a level.

A leash is annoying as it keeps the pet too close to you and can interfere in several situations.

They can trigger some awful traps which can hurt even you.

And they can even turn feral if you're not careful.

Now, the only upside of keeping a standard pet, is the BUC identification, and some help when fighting (usually they don't, the end up chasing a grid bug when 5 trolls are rushing you). Oh, and stealing from shops, though that's limited (they can't get big stuff), and there are other ways to steal anyway.

So the question is, is it worth it keeping a pet? Especially at low level?

Or should you dump the pet and tame a decent monster?

In a non-conduct game, keep the pet until you are sure you can survive without, then abandon it. As a pacifist, your life depends on your pets. Keep 3-4 of them, and shove them on a polytrap to improve them before you go much farther down than say dungeon level 10. It pays off to learn the art of luring pets, and credit cloning.Tjr 18:04, September 14, 2010 (UTC)

Also, a magic whistle massively cuts down on the problem of having to go back to get pets, and is useful for keeping them away from peacefuls you want alive (although other than the minetown priest and (sometimes) shopkeepers, it doesn't really matter if they wipe out peaceful monsters). As for which pet is best, by far warhorses: they're fast, have a higher level than dogs/cats, and don't eat desirable corpses other than lichens. The downside is that you have to keep them fed on vegan food, but there's usually enough of that in the dungeon. -Ion frigate 22:00, September 14, 2010 (UTC)

Each stage of the game its pet choice. Warhorses are good before you find a polytrap, but they die very quickly in Gehennom.

Tjr 04:48, September 15, 2010 (UTC)

Yes, I should have been clearer; I meant of the starting pets/easily tameable ones (i.e. cats, dogs, horses), warhorses are the best. -Ion frigate 06:48, September 15, 2010 (UTC)

Rogue ranged preference

What is the prefered ranged choice for Rogues?

Daggers are my usual choice, as the rogue can level up the Dagger skill quite quickly, but I was wondering whether there are any alternatives. Like, besides carrying daggers, you could carry a crossbow with poisoned bolts? Because I generally think melee should be avoided when playing a Rogue, unless you have a crazy enchanted main artifact.

What are your opinions?

Daggers are probably best: they're plentiful, relatively damaging, and they are never destroyed on impact. If you want to go for a poisoned weapon, go for darts instead. You can get a lot of them out of dart traps, whereas bolts are often quite hard to find, and the damage gained from them isn't that much. Also, not having to switch weapons when monsters get within melee range (and they will) can be a lifesaver, particularly against fast monsters.

As for melee with rogues, they can always get Stormbringer, either from crowning or sacrifice. Combined with skilled proficiency in broadswords, it's pretty deadly and for my rogues eventually becomes their main weapon. But in the early game, yes, melee is better avoided if possible. -Ion frigate 17:10, September 19, 2010 (UTC)

Trapped in Sokoban

Oh boy. I'm in quite a mess. I'm playing a lvl 10 Knight, and I'm currently stuck on the first level of Sokoban. How? I completely forgot that the two scrolls there are Earth scrolls, and the boulders trapped me in a corner. I tried jumping away with no sucess. I also removed all my clothing and dropped everything and tried to fit through, nothing. I had a wand of magic missile but it's out of charges. I have a wand of lightning but it doesn't destroy boulders. I tried praying, but it was too early and he was displeased.

Now, I think the only way to get out of here, is to pray, but I'm unsure whether my god can do anything about it. I can post my inventory if you'd like, but I don't think I have anything that can get me out of there. Right now, I think I should just wait and try to pray later. I have a few food rations that should make me last for quite a while.

What can I do otherwise?

EDIT: Nevermind, YASD. I prayed, and he teleported me near the entrance, sorrounded with monster. I killed most of them, but they backed me against the wall, and since I had used most of my items trying to escape, I had no way to survive... Except jumping, which I only remembered I could do just after I got killed. Oh well.

Advice on how to proceed

So, this is the farthest I've ever gone, so I'm going to take it nice and slow.

Lvl 12 Barbarian, Chaotic. Intrinsics: Poison, Shock, Cold, Speed, Telepathy.

125hp. Wielding a +5 two handed sword. Wearing +0 crystal plate mail, +0 high boots, +0 leather gloves. AC is 0. Plus I'm wearing an amulet of reflection (I had better equipment but... polymorph trap :/

Got a wand of death and a a few others, a couple of scrolls of teleportation, a ring of teleport control (wearing it) and like 6 unidentified rings.

Now the question is, should I go further down? I'm in dlevel 23. Can I take on what's down there? I think I should probably go up and try and get some better armor, but there's nothing in Minetown... I haven't done Sokoban and Mine's end, maybe I should do those first and hope to find something good?

What do you guys think?

Edit: Thanks for the tips. If you're wondering how it went down, I basically finished Sokoban and the mines, where I found nothing decent, only a +1 blessed ring of protection. So I proceeded carefully, killed Medusa for the first time (she stoned herself) but it all went downhill from there. I wanted to start double wielding, and found a broadsword on her level, and well, it was cursed, and -2. I went around a couple of levels looking for scrolls of remove curse, blessed potions of water, or altars, nothing. I prayed here and there, but with no success. I managed to enter the castle in the end, but soon got stomped by a minotaur.I was used prayer to heal and bashed him some more, but he wouldn't die (I was hitting him with a cursed -2 broadsword, after all) and I managed to escape barely, with about 13 HP, where two fire ants trapped me and finished me off.

Still, it's the furthest I've ever gone, and I've learned some good lessons from it. And besides, it was fun :) Thanks again.

If you can handle d23, then you can definitely finish Mine's End and Sokoban. You already have reflection so the Sokoban final reward might be redundant, but even the items all over the lower floors may be useful. Just watch for more poly traps in the lower levels.

Your biggest priority should be magic resistance. Try to find a kill a gray dragon for the scales. Your AC also needs to be lowered; DSM will help with that. Try to secure some enchant armor scrolls and bless them. Also, get a cloak. Elven cloaks are the best that can be easily obtained; you'll need MC3, especially if you switch to DSM. Check the wiki for how to get DSM; reverse genocide is usually the best. Stand on burned Elbereth and you;ll be fine, since you have reflection. -- Qazmlpok 15:20, September 22, 2010 (UTC)

So...I have acquired all three artifacts to open the Sanctum and found the vibrating square. I applied the candelabrum and it lit giving off a powerful light, I applied the bell but "it didn't make any sound." Then I read the book of the dead...but "something is wrong" and lots of monsters appeared. None of the items were cursed. What is going wrong? Does a Bell need a charge? I have looked for other answers but am not coming up with any other answers. Any help?

Yes, the bell of opening needs to have at least one charge. You'll need to find a scroll of charging and use it on the bell. Also, make sure you snuff the candles on the candelabrum so they don't burn out while you get the scroll. -- Qazmlpok 11:58, October 4, 2010 (UTC)

Innvocation Problems

Some help, please? I’m trying to complete my first ascension and I am close enough to taste it, maybe that’s my problem. I have collected all of the invocation artifacts and found the vibrating square. I put the candles on and lit them. Then I applied the bell “but there is no sound.” Then I read the book …”something is wrong “ and a mass of creatures appear. None of artifacts were cursed. I am wondering what I am doing wrong? It is the bell, does it need charges?

Also, after doing this twice and finally killing all of the creatures and Rodney, now the Book of the Dead is cursed and I have no means to uncurse it. Any suggestions?

As above, yeah it's the bell that need[ed] a charge. Now, to uncurse the Book; do you still have the Castle wand of wishing? Cursed items are a problem that can be wished away; just wish for a 2 blessed scrolls of remove curse or 2 potions of holy water. The latter is probably the better choice, since you can use it to make more of the same (dilute potions twice, dip stacks of water in the holy water). Make sure to make more before using it to uncurse the book.

If you don't have any wishes left, you might be able to write a scroll of remove curse with a magic marker. Unless you're a lucky wizard, this will fail at least 2/3 of the time if you haven't identified the scroll. However, a fully-charged magic marker will, on average, be able to write at least one scroll of remove curse as long as you've maxed out your luck (if you haven't, do that now... see luck for how). Make sure the scroll you're writing on is uncursed, wield the book, and read the scroll. Other options include dipping it in a fountain repeatedly (until the water "glows for a moment"), zapping it with a wand of cancellation, an occasional effect from praying at altars, learning and casting remove curse, or wielding the book and repeatedly stepping on a magic trap.

Whatever you do, do it quickly; the wizard is going to be harassing you every few hundred turns, and fighting him and his summoned minions repeatedly can bring down even a high-level character. Try to zap him with a wand of death every time he appears. -Ion frigate 19:56, October 5, 2010 (UTC)